Ep 180 - Speaking with Gravitas with Dr. Susan Laverick

Are you ready to transform your public speaking skills and learn how to speak with gravitas? In this episode of The Quiet And Strong Podcast, host David Hall sits down with communication expert Dr. Susan Laverick to uncover the secrets behind impactful presentations and speeches.

Listeners will discover the importance of identifying a key message, crafting opening hooks, and harnessing the power of storytelling to captivate any audience. The episode also provides essential tips for both in-person and online speaking, emphasizing using body language and using a strong connection with listeners.

Additionally, Susan offers invaluable advice for dealing with the fear of public speaking and understanding the myths surrounding introverts' abilities as speakers. Whether you’re an introvert or simply someone looking to enhance your public speaking abilities, this episode offers practical strategies and motivational insights that are guaranteed to boost your confidence.

Tune in to learn why preparation is key, how to create audience-centric communications, and the importance of speaking with presence. Be inspired to embrace your strengths, refine your communication skills, and effectively convey your message with confidence.

Listen now to empower your voice…and be strong.

Episode Link: QuietandStrong.com/180

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Dr. Susan Laverick, is a communication expert who delights in smashing myths about speaking in public such as “speakers are born”, “charisma is key”, or “the podium is not introvert friendly”. She develops individual styles and teaches the vital techniques underpinning confident presenting. She trains peacebuilders to powerfully pitch projects, prepares peace laureates for speeches at UN Rotary Day, trains TEDx speakers and mentors emerging leaders. 600 people across the academic, NGO and corporate sectors have experienced her acclaimed flagship workshop, “Speaking with Confidence, Presenting with Impact.” Her proudest moment was being hired by a global peace foundation to develop the communication skills of female peace workers in conflict zones, and to help former armed-combatants to return to civil society by articulating new narratives.

Connect with Susan: LinkedIn
Website: LaverickConsulting.com

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Contact the Host of the Quiet and Strong Podcast:

David Hall

Author, Speaker, Educator, Podcaster

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Transcript

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:00:00]:
For me, it's a really important distinction and it's, a misconception that most people have, which is public speaking, it conjures vivid and sometimes terrifying pictures of podiums and vast audiences. And anyone who is nervous about speaking in public will think that's not for me. And the thing I tell my ambassadors, my diplomats, my students, anyone I'm teaching, that the moment we're speaking to more than 2 people, we are engaged in public speaking.

David Hall [00:00:44]:
Hello, and welcome to episode 180 of the Quiet and Strong podcast, especially for introverts. I'm your host, David Hall, the creator of quietandstrong.com. This is a weekly podcast dedicated to understanding the strengths and needs of introverts. Introversion is not something to fix, but to be embraced. Normally, we will air each episode on a Monday. Be sure to subscribe on your favorite platform. Leave a review or rating. That would mean a lot to me and also help others find the show.

David Hall [00:01:12]:
Tell a friend about the podcast. Help get the word out there that introversion is a beautiful thing. Doctor Susan Laverick is a communication expert who delights in smashing myths about speaking in public, such as speakers are born, charisma is key, or the podium is not introvert friendly. She develops individual styles and teaches the vital techniques underpinning confident presenting. She trains peace builders to powerfully pitch projects, prepares peace laureates for speeches at UN Rotary Day, trains TEDx speakers and mentors, emerging leaders. 600 people across the academic NGO and corporate sectors have experienced her Acclaim flagship workshop, speaking with confidence, presenting with impact. Her proudest moment was being hired by a Global Peace Foundation to develop the communication skills of female peace workers in conflict zones and to help former armed combatants to return to civil society by articulating new narratives. Susan is a guest lecturer at the Geneva Graduate Institute and the University of Geneva, where she teaches the art of ethical and influential communication to future leaders.

David Hall [00:02:32]:
She has a doctorate in English, completed on an Australian government research scholarship, a first class honors degree in English literature, masters in history, and is a ICF qualified executive coach. Alright. Doctor Susan Laverick, welcome to the Quiet and Strong podcast. It's so great to have you on, Susan.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:02:51]:
Thanks, David.

David Hall [00:02:52]:
We're gonna get into the great work that you do, but first, let's just hear a little bit more about you. Tell us about your journey to the work that you're doing now.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:03:00]:
Well, thank you for asking me. I could be here for 2 days, but I shall keep it very succinct. I never expected to be working in the peace building sector as a communication adviser, that we all have journeys. Life often sends us curveballs. So my career began at the BBC and by rights, I should still be there. But various things happened, and we ended up moving countries, and I had to reevaluate what I was going to do. Many changes. I did English teaching.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:03:31]:
I did a lot of other things within the community in Geneva, and eventually was offered to do a doctorate in English, which I just loved. And as a consequence of that, met a lot of people in the Geneva peace building world and was offered a job, if you like, to give a lecture on effective communication because given that that was my background in language and linguistics and at the BBC, and really that was the catalyst that has led me in the last 15 years to this role which I absolutely love and adore. I'm not in conflict zones but I am working on the sidelines helping very brave people who are going in or even in post conflict zones. So, yeah, I just in a nutshell, that's how I ended up. And I would never have expected to have been doing this if you'd talked to me even 20 years ago.

David Hall [00:04:30]:
Yeah. Yeah. It's crazy how that works out. Yeah. But you're doing important work in around communication, but tell us why you prefer to say speaking with gravitas versus public speaking. What's the difference there for you?

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:04:45]:
For me, it's a really important distinction and it's, a misconception that most people have, which is public speaking. It conjures vivid and sometimes terrifying pictures of podiums and vast audiences. And anyone who is nervous about speaking in public will think that's not for me. And the thing I tell my ambassadors, my diplomats, my students, anyone I'm teaching, that the moment we're speaking to more than 2 people, we are engaged in public speaking. And so the skills I teach are effectively the ones we all need to deliver an effective speech in public. But I think everyone's goal, mine particularly as I'm giving many more speeches as a professional speaker, is to be able to harness those skills of gravitas and presence. And really, that's what any public speaker needs. So I just find it's a softer term than public speaking.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:05:48]:
And I learned very early when I because I'm guest lecturer in a couple of the universities in Geneva, which I love, And I learned not to call it public speaking because people just were really bothered. So it's as euphemism, it works really well.

David Hall [00:06:03]:
Yeah. That's a really important distinction because, really, it's about communication, whether it's speaking to a couple people, small group, giving a presentation. There's lots of ways that we communicate, and it's not just getting up in front of, you know, several thousand people. It it's in all aspects of our life. And so what is to you, what is effective communication?

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:06:27]:
Well, given the world we're living in at the moment, I think it's a vital skill that many governments could be well advised to acquire. And having said that, I am actually doing some work for a government in July, and I'll tell you offline what that is because it's very confidential. It's in another it's not in in Switzerland and it's not in the UK. But it's exactly that, what you've just said, which is the the art of effective communication is what we're doing now. And I know you. You're a I don't know you personally, but I like you and I like your style, but you're a very good list listener. You're a very good interviewer. And really, when I'm teaching effective communication, that's always the fundamentals of where I start.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:07:12]:
We're talking about active listening, respect. The message I send might not be the message you receive, and it won't be your fault. It will be mine because there's no clarity, or my key message isn't there. And the notion of what kind of content are we talking about. And I think above all taking stress out of situations because often in professional environments particularly, especially the ones I'm working in, people are stressed because time is is very urgent. And even in the corporate world, people are very edgy, and you're just thinking, just relax, do some deep breathing. Because if you can't de stress, then that whole notion of assertive versus aggressive communication will come into play. So I guess that for me is what is so important.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:08:04]:
It's it's the give listening, respectful listening, and clarity of what we want to say. And I'm sure you've had people on the program. I'm I'm not denigrating, but I certainly listen to podcasts where I'm thinking, what are not yours.

David Hall [00:08:19]:
What

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:08:20]:
what are you trying to say? What is the what's the point of this? And it's just that notion of say it, think it, say it, and deliver it clearly.

David Hall [00:08:29]:
So what's your advice? How do we clarify our messages so we make sure that we're we're sending the right message?

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:08:36]:
Well, I think first of all, we have to know who is our audience. I always say to people, even if it's, they're preparing for a pitch, which might have investors or presentation to peace building investors, humanitarians, audience before content. However small you're meeting, however large your sphere, what who is your audience and then what is your content? And I think that is really the most important thing. And I'm sure you've had situations or you know situations where people have said to you, oh, look. I was in this meeting, and I really couldn't get out my I couldn't articulate my point, and someone else said it, and I I just couldn't get in. And or I said it, and they didn't listen. And often it's because the clarity of that expression is missing because the thinking I mean, communication just just doesn't come automatically. It's it's process, a cognitive process.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:09:36]:
So that's something I'm very strict about when I'm especially teaching or preparing people for interviews that we can think in advance what might be asked, how will we deal with it. So when someone says, well, why did you x, y, and zed on the 3rd November? You can say, ah, well and you have a fairly rational and articulate response.

David Hall [00:09:59]:
Yeah. Definitely, preparation is key. You know, we talk a lot about introversion on this show, and I think even more so because introverts tech typically aren't great at thinking on their feet. So the preparation is is is key, and it's key for everybody, of course.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:10:16]:
And just jumping in there. I mean, of course, there are moments when we we can't prepare. But I think even going into any meeting, and we're not quite sure what is this agenda going to be, just to note down some 4 topics that you might think these are things I could chip in on or just to have some guide to how you might intervene rather than floundering. But absolutely.

David Hall [00:10:41]:
Yeah. And it's important to be prepared with those topics so that you can participate early on and not, you know, not let the like you were saying, let the conversation already have gone past you.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:10:54]:
Yeah. Absolutely. And then it's too late. I have so many people saying, oh, I wish I had, and I it's too late. That moment won't come.

David Hall [00:11:02]:
So when it does come to public speaking, whether that be a presentation or a pitch or or whatever or in front of a large audience, what does make an impactful speech?

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:11:12]:
The absolutely non negotiable starting point for me and for those I'm training or speak people I'm writing speeches for is that we have to be audience centric, not speaker centric. And that means knowing that what we're delivering is going to serve a need rather than, oh my god. I've got to give a speech. And while you're in the middle of delivering it, I hope they like me. Why aren't they laughing at my joke? And I think it's that notion again of knowing an audience, and above all, knowing ourselves, that self awareness conversation. So I think it's really right from the outset, this is not about you. And and I say that to a lot of people, and they look at me and they say, but I've been asked to give the speech. It is about me.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:12:03]:
But I'm saying that you have been asked to give a speech or an update or a pitch, but, ultimately, you're giving information that a certain audience needs. And the moment we lose the thread, it's like act it's active listening in, in a funny way. The moment I stop listening to you and I'm thinking my husband's tapping on some pipe downstairs, and I I start worrying about what's he doing to the plumbing? I lose our connection, and we can't afford to do that as communicators, as humans, because communication is communal. And when it isn't, that's when it doesn't work.

David Hall [00:12:40]:
Yeah. And I think that's something that's a concept that doesn't come intuitively to a lot of people. You know, they're they're there. They they think, okay. Well, I gotta perform well and but, really, they're they're forgetting about the purpose is is really connecting with the audience. And, you know, what does the audience need to hear from me? Yeah. How do we how do we learn to do that to really engage and connect with the audience on what it is that they need from us?

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:13:08]:
Well, it depends, of course, what the purpose of this so called speech or presentation is, but whether it's a keynote or it's a, it's a training or it's a seminar, I think it's, we have the material as long as the material is relevant to the needs of the audience, but it needs to have a human connection. I could I could give you a 2 hour lecture about communication and rhetoric, and you would be sitting there, David, thinking, tell me now. This is the most boring topic I have ever heard. So I have all that information in my mind, but I have to frame it with a story. And I think we talked about this in our conversations earlier on email that whatever the material we have will come to life because of the content, but because of our awareness that people want to be entertained. They want they want something to hook into. And if it's a story that will frame this really important conversation about why we have to be effective communicators or how this can change a business's pitch, then that is what it's all about. And the moment we cease to think about that audience and dwell more on, I hope they liked it.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:14:26]:
I hope they're going to really love it. I've done the best I can. I've put this story in. I've structured it. I've done the funnel in terms of what is the best content, and the structure is persuasive or it's challenging. And it's it I find it it's alchemy. It really is. When it all these bits come together, the catalyst for the alchemy is the human connection.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:14:50]:
And some people don't ever get that.

David Hall [00:14:52]:
Yeah. Yes. Let's talk about storytelling because we are built on stories as humans, and I that's something I actually had to learn. Like, I, you know, know just here's the facts that you need to present. And so for the longest time, that's what I did, but I've learned that, you know, we are built on stories, and we need to share our stories. And it can make all the difference in the world in in conveying our message and and and really hitting home with them. So tell us more about stories and how we craft our stories to give in our in our communication.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:15:27]:
Well, I really like that you, first of all, highlighted the the reality that we, I think we're the same generation, we were brought up to not talk about ourselves. So you go in, give a speech and or give information and that's finished. And I think it's taking a risk and that comes back to the preparation. And I'm a great 1 for preparation for speeches. And sometimes people will say to me, I haven't got a story. I go, yes, you do. But you don't know which 1 yet. And often people, for example, I give you an example.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:16:02]:
There was 1 of my peace laureates who was giving a speech at the UN, and I was training 6, and I was doing this for 7 years every year. It's the research which is interesting. And I said, that's pivotal but we need to hear about you or find a story. And he said, just as you said then he said how do I find a story? And I said come on you've been working on this project for 8 years and and then he said to me do do you know I've got lots of stories? And I said, wonderful. Let's tell me. Just don't tell me them all. But and he was because I could have been there until, well, today. And the story he came up with was so profoundly moving.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:16:43]:
It was I mean, I won't go into the details, but the reason he started this NGO helping women in childbirth who had no access to medical care, he gave us the story of a midwife who walked 4 kilometers every day to help women in childbirth. And but the way he told it to me, I said, I'm writing this down now. Just repeat it to me because this and this story was just incredibly moving. So I think we all have a story inside us. And if you're like me, I have dozens, but then I have to have quite a few when I'm giving presentations and courses. But there's always something. And even I I gave a very serious example. But I was in Vienna last year giving a keynote for an event, and I had had an accident with my dress.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:17:35]:
And I was so embarrassed by this the dress I had to wear. I know this is very boring for you, but I made a story out of it. And I said, do you know, I came with a beautiful dress, and I'm not dressed in an elegant way. But let me tell you what happened. They loved it. And afterwards and they liked the presentation as well. But that human story, you might say, well, that was a bit risky. Did they invite you back? But it's, as I say to everyone, we we are connected by our humanity and we love stories.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:18:09]:
As you said, it's it's a need we've had for millennia. We love stories.

David Hall [00:18:15]:
Yeah. That's for sure. So you had to wear a different dress?

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:18:18]:
Well, I mean, it was really embarrassing because the dress I wore was just it. But it didn't matter. And I thought and that was some modeling too. It wasn't about me because I was just saying, oh my god. I just I mean, it was okay. But it was about what I was giving to the audience. I had no choice. It as they say, the show goes on.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:18:37]:
But I managed to make it amusing, and I just thought, well, it was the right thing to do to because they were lawyers. Very nice people, but they're not like they're fairly serious people. And, so yeah.

David Hall [00:18:53]:
I think it's also an example that as far as, like, some of our worries and fears that we're thinking about ourselves or, you know, you're thinking about your dress much more than anybody else is

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:19:05]:
is even

David Hall [00:19:06]:
worried about. That's a that's a key thing in all this too.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:19:09]:
And it's the spotlight effect, isn't it? What we think people are looking at, they don't even care. Yeah. Because they don't. Notice.

David Hall [00:19:16]:
And and that kind of goes into the next question. There's a lot of talk about just the fear of public speaking. Like, people are terrified. Introverts and extroverts are terrified of public speaking. If there is that fear, how do we overcome that?

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:19:31]:
Well, let's quantify fear for the moment. There is there is phobia, which there's glossophobia, which is obviously a real phobia. Someone just cannot talk because they freeze. Unfortunately, very few people I've met have ever suffered from that. And I doubt I could help them because that's acute social anxiety and it comes with very many physical manifestations. But for those who hate public speaking, there's usually a reason for that. Either they've never done it before and they're surrounded by people who are really talented and they measure themselves. It's that great comparison that we do as humans or they had a bad experience.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:20:14]:
And so it's understanding where is that fear coming from? Was there a trigger? And can we overcome it? And 10 times out of 10, doing my own sales work here, it's it's overcomeable, if that's such a word, but it does take a lot of trust in oneself. And when and and as I say, if you go back to 1 person in particular I was helping, she said, oh my god. I hate I hate having to do this. Her company made her come to me to get this training. So public speaking, and they're all shaky. And at the bottom of it was a presentation she'd made 6 months previously, which she hadn't prepared. She'd only rustled together. And of course, it was a disaster.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:21:02]:
And I said, well, that's why it was such a bad experience. So if you forget that or move away from that and people often say to me, well, we we can't always prepare a presentation. If you're asked to make a presentation, you have got time to prepare. And that was her problem. And she said to me afterwards, actually, you were right. It was the memory and the humiliation were terrible. But when we realized it was it wasn't her, she wasn't a bad speaker. She just hadn't she just hadn't prepared.

David Hall [00:21:35]:
Yeah. And, I mean, for me, I used to get extremely nervous, but I learned for myself, especially as an introvert, that preparation was key, you know, and that I had to think ahead of time. I had to gather my stories. You know? I had to think about what I wanted to say. And, of course, if someone just asked me to speak on the fly, I could do it, but it's not gonna be my best work usually, unless it's something I've thought a lot about. Like, I could give a speech on introversion any old time.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:22:10]:
But that's the thing, and I'm the same. I wouldn't call myself introvert because I love I love teaching and being out there. But I am like you, if I'm asked to give a speech, I would devote 6 weeks to it because it must I'm not saying I learn it off by heart. I do a pitch if I'm doing a 2 minute. Yes. But like you, if you are in control of every part of that speech, then the speech won't be in control of you. And there's no yes. We all have butterflies.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:22:42]:
And that's great because there's good stress. That's that's keeping us just before we speak, it's the part and the you can feel yourself thinking, oh gosh. It's my turn. And I still feel that as a as a professional speaker, and they pay me lots of money to speak. So I must be doing the right thing. But it's absolutely what you said. It's preparation for something very important

David Hall [00:23:05]:
that

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:23:05]:
it's worth.

David Hall [00:23:06]:
Absolutely. And so that leads into the next thing. You know, you talk about some myths around public speaking, especially if when it comes to introverts or highly sensitive people. You have 5 myths. Let's talk about those.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:23:22]:
Well, I think the 1 that I really get upset about is that great speakers are born, and that will cripple the rest of us because we're not all great speakers. And it's important to remember that, for example, Steve Jobs had a he had a real phobia about speaking in public. And there's a clip of him in the eighties when we still watch television. And he was about to be interviewed and he was he had to keep disappearing because he was absolutely upchucking in the bathroom. And Winston Churchill, we think of him as a great orator, but he had an inability to express his ideas and he overcame it. So I would say that great speakers are trained and if you are a good speaker then you just keep honing your skill. And that for me is so key especially for introverts because they always assume that because they're quiet and they don't dominate that their voice isn't worth listening to or sit back and let this the the louder voices dominate. And I can tell you this, that some of the best speakers and I just mentioned mentioned Steve Jobs, and he was an introvert.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:24:39]:
1 of my most brilliant clients was is an introvert and she said to me I will never be able to make this. She I trained her to do a TEDx talk and she said, I can't do it. I've been asked to do it. And I said, you can, but if you don't want to, I'm not going to push you. And because she devoted the preparation and the rehearsal, she and she was trembling at the beginning, and I gave her all the breathing exercises. But because she took the time to devote to this process, she was accomplished, impressive. And everyone said, oh, my gosh. How did she do it? Because she's always said she was a hopeless speaker.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:25:20]:
And and I think introverts have that huge level of resilience and that capacity to focus and be disciplined about the the rehearsals. And I love it because not everyone will do that for me. And and I was sorry. I'll I'll shush in a minute. I get very passionate about this. I say to people, if you're not prepared to do the rehearsals, I'm not working with you because it's not worth it. It's like playing a musical instrument and having a lesson once a week and not doing the the the daily rehearsal. Do you see?

David Hall [00:25:51]:
Yeah. And I think that's a key point too. So introverts, we actually have a lot to say. It's a myth that we don't because we're always thinking. So we have a lot to say. It's just, you know, we're not saying as much because we're thinking before we're speaking. But as far as, you know, being confident in our speaking, I think that's that's a key is knowing that our message is important, you know, that people need to hear it. Even if we're not maybe speaking as much as somebody else, we still our message is important.

David Hall [00:26:23]:
And that's that's been a key for me knowing that, you know, whether I'm asked to speak or I'm seeking out the opportunity, I have something I have something important to say.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:26:34]:
And that to me is absolutely crucial because sometimes, especially younger people, they don't think they have something important to say. And it's almost coaxing them into a confidence zone. And that's where group work is really valuable working. And I work obviously, I take classes. I whenever I'm hired to do a program, I can't say, how many introverts are in your class? And it just becomes evident to me immediately as I'm working the room and getting to know people that I I yes. That's that's someone I will need to to spend more attention and give more care to and make sure that they speak. And it's true. And often at the end of my programs, the introverts are the ones who queue up afterwards saying it was a wonderful course.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:27:21]:
And I'm not saying that's because I'm a brilliant trainer, but because I felt listened to and you made me feel valued. And now I feel I can do that.

David Hall [00:27:31]:
Yes. What about the myth of charisma? Do we all need to have charisma to be great speakers?

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:27:37]:
Do you know that is 1 of my great I I was saying that, great speakers are born is 1 of my hobby horses, but, no, the myth is that we need charisma, and it's those brilliant speakers who can command a room and but the difference between charisma and presence, they're very different. Charisma is a word that, as you would know, comes from the Greek, charisma, gift of the gods. It's that quality of charm, and we all love the person who will speak and make us laugh at parties or people and some political leaders have that charisma for not and don't use it to good effect. But often those people with charisma aren't very substantial speakers. And I can think of 1 political leader in the UK who was full of charisma, but everything he said was, what what the hell was that all about? Whereas presence is something we can all acquire. And that comes down to the gravitas, the the, the confidence in your communication, the effective communication we were talking about earlier, and the learning to breed a room and understanding the temperature of a room, as I as I call it, and being able to respond to energy and make adjustments in whatever style you have. So absolutely, there are occasions when some people have charisma and presence, but mostly, they are 2 different skills. And many academic researchers would say, you're wrong, but I'm right because I'm a Gemini and I'm very dogmatic.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:29:11]:
And presence can always be acquired, And communication is is the common denominator there.

David Hall [00:29:19]:
How do you coach someone on presence that doesn't feel like they have it?

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:29:25]:
Well, most people say they don't have presence. They say, oh, look, because we don't know really what it means. And the objective of my training is to give people the communication skills so that they can communicate with clarity. They can command a room in time, although that takes a while. And the foundational skills in presence are your communication skills. How do you all of those things we've been talking about. So never I always say to people, never neglect your communication skills. It's it's how we talk in meetings, how we interact in interviews, our active listening skills, our ability to let others speak in meetings and and intervene when we need to, and, of course, to be able to deliver pictures or presentations as we need to.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:30:14]:
Just repeating my phrase there. But any anything we learn, any confidence we acquire in delivering a communication piece will immediately enhance our profile, and people will think, oh, that person gave a really good speech. And it's also what people how people perceive you. And if you're if if 1 is more invisible and think, oh, I'm not going to try that. I haven't got it. Then the professional visibility will remain completely unchanged.

David Hall [00:30:46]:
So when you're coaching, is it, is it different coaching introverts versus extroverts?

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:30:51]:
I don't tend to work 1 to 1 unless I'm doing master classes And I'm have to be honest, I haven't had introverts on those. But I can say in group classes in for companies when I go in to deliver programs, They just need, as I said to you earlier, when I'm reading a room and I'm getting, okay, that person and that person, they just need extra, support, sounds very patronizing, encouragement because they have to move beyond be from behind their screen. And they do because when they and I think that's where group training can be very valuable. And people are always very kind and feedback. I always encourage feedback from exercises I'm giving. And but it's true that I never push someone who's uncomfortable. I'll always say, are you are you happy to do this? And mostly, they will. And I have never had someone who has refused because of great stress, but I think empathy is very important.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:31:56]:
Very important.

David Hall [00:31:58]:
Yeah. And like we were talking about, I, I think the preparation is a little different between introverts and extroverts. I think, you know, because we think before we speak, I think that the preparation can look a little bit different. And, I am, like I said, I'm not the I'm not gonna be the best at winging it, and an extroverted friend might be better at that than me. What What do you say about that? Can an introvert wing a speech?

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:32:26]:
I would be counseling against it, and I would also counsel anyone against it. And you mentioned before, you could stand up and talk for 2 hours about issues connected to being a talented introvert. I could talk for 2 hours. But it's if when the stakes are high, never wing it. It's just not worth it because the things that can go wrong and you can't the problem is take that kind of risk unless you're a barrister and can do that very easily. I mean, I could do 2 minutes. No problem. But I would not.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:32:58]:
He said to me, Susan, can you do a speech on Friday? I would certainly give it a huge amount of thought because once that speech is out there, the the impression has already been made. People are very I always say audiences are kind, and they are, but audiences also expect to be entertained or informed and to be paid back for the time they've given to sit in on a a meeting or a presentation or a speech.

David Hall [00:33:27]:
Yeah. And I heard you talk about, you know, sometimes the shorter speeches, maybe the 2 minute speech are actually more difficult to prepare than the longer speech. What do you mean by that?

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:33:40]:
I mean that and I'm not talking about a business pitch, but I'm talking about sometimes, for example, the work I have been doing in New York and in Geneva with these peace laureates where they have to condense or no. That's the wrong word. They have to put together a 2 minute speech to present sometimes a project of 8 years, And that requires a huge amount of work. And everyone in the field of oratory recognizes that the 2 minute speech is the most challenging because it has to be absolutely each part, it's like a chain. Each part has to be consecutively linked, and you have to have the hooks and the the the the the content. And it it's telling a story very quickly, giving a lot of information. It's giving a glimpse. That's the that's what I'm trying to say.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:34:36]:
A 2 minute speech is often used as a, if you like, a quick introduction to a larger piece of work. So it has to be very enticing. And therefore, I will you'd be horrified if I told you how many drafts I get these laureates to go through. Sometimes it's 7, 8, 9 until we've we've done this with the funnel. And your viewers or your listeners won't see it, but imagine a big funnel. And we're putting everything into the mix, and eventually, it's distilling down. And we've, these are the gold nuggets. These these are the gems that are going to showcase.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:35:13]:
And and this is how we're going to curate and assemble this speech. So it becomes almost a work of art. I'm probably being a bit precious here, but that gives you a sense of how passionately I feel about of course, it depends on context. If it's a wedding speech, well, then I'm sure people write their speeches on the back of an envelope, but, they do require a lot of care and respect.

David Hall [00:35:38]:
Yeah. And it's getting to those those gems that you're talking about that, you know, you have a very important message, but you have a very short time to deliver it. It's really what what is the most important thing that I need to say here, and that can be more difficult to prepare.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:35:54]:
And that I'm glad you mentioned that because it's that notion of a key message. And people say, oh, I know what a key message is. It's this. But the key message is the 1 thing you want someone to take away from your presentation. And if if you don't know what your key message is and it's all blah blah and it's all waffle, then it's not gonna have an impact. And and I often find that the hooks that are so important to the opening of that speech and even the story of a miniature story, they often are embedded in all these drafts. So I'll be going through all these drafts with a I haven't got my highlighter pen, but I have a a very a good editing pen, and I'll I'll think that's their story, and that's the opening hook. And so it's not me who's written it, but it's it's in this wealth of, paperwork.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:36:45]:
And if they hadn't gone through that process of just, look, put the story in it, put what is important, and we'll then work from there. And and it's it's impression impressive. I was gonna say, impress you or not. It's impressive what people can achieve in 260 words.

David Hall [00:37:04]:
Yeah. Do you have any general advice, whether it be a short speech or a longer speech, just in preparation?

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:37:12]:
Yes. I think always remember, first of all, who is the audience? What is your purpose? And what message do you want to take away. And knowing your audience will make you realize, well, are they experts or do they need to be informed? Knowing your purpose, do I need to persuade, or am I how how am I going to structure this speech? And making sure that you have 3 solid messages. Because as we know, people tend to only remember, if you're lucky, 3 things from the speech. So absolutely audience before content, your your purpose, and what your outcome is. What what you what do you want from the speech? Because that's the other thing and I'll say this very briefly. People often forget about what do you what do we want people to do with the information we've shared? The the the communication is a 2 way process. So I give you a 2 minute speech or a 5 minute speech about x, but I really want you to go away and do something.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:38:14]:
I might want you to sign up to my program. I might want you to collaborate with me. I might I might want some investments. So it all helps to really think about it in a holistic way. Again, that very important question, what do I want out of it or from the peep from my audience?

David Hall [00:38:31]:
Yeah. That's great advice. So you give a speech, and then there's the q and a, which can strike fear in people as well because, like, what if they what if they ask you something you just don't know?

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:38:43]:
Well, I've had that before. And the the sensible thing is to be honest and say, I can't answer that for you. I'm I'm sorry. I actually wouldn't apologize. I always tell people off for apologizing. But 1 thing I do urge people, especially when I'm training speakers who are doing major addresses, we go through a process of what I call eliminating the fear factor. And as you say, q and a can be terrifying if you're not prepared. And really, it is the most important part of the speech because it's the time you're bringing the audience has a chance to grill you and really get to know you a bit more.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:39:22]:
And I always urge people to think about 3 questions they would not wish to be answered because and and that's that's quite scary because you think, oh my god. What have they asked me about? Why did I do this? And when I was at the, at this peace event, what went wrong there? I mean, I'm making that up, but to be really honest and brave and thinking, ask those to yourself, make yourself answer them. And people struggle with that, they say oh my god, I really don't want to even think about that' and I said 'but that's the purpose of this exercise. Let's think about it. Because the chances are if you do get a hostile question, you might if you've been prepared by me, we would already have been covering not the precise question, obviously, but we would already have covered that that dangerous territory, which is quicksand as you know. You get a speaker who can't answer it's alright not to answer a question because you don't know the answer. We can talk about it later. But to not answer a question, and that's, as you know, I'm sure, how quickly hostility can creep into that segment.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:40:34]:
And then it can be very unpleasant.

David Hall [00:40:37]:
Yeah. Yeah. So try and prepare, especially for those things that you think, you know, might might be asked. And then we can't prepare for everything like you're saying. So be ready to say, you know what? III don't know.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:40:52]:
Well, hopefully, say it more diplomatically. Yeah.

David Hall [00:40:55]:
Right. Right. Right. Yes. In a better in a better way.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:40:58]:
No. Absolutely. But I think to be as prepared as possible is is and the chances are that that being an expert in whatever field 1 is presenting at, it's gonna be a fairly safe territory other than those unexpected questions.

David Hall [00:41:12]:
Yeah. So so much of what we're doing now is online. Do you have any general tips for presenting and speaking online?

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:41:21]:
Yeah. Do you know, David, I really believe that speaking online, we have to just be more accessible. And we've obviously, we've got our cameras on, and our eye contact is very good. I'm looking at you while I'm talking to you. You're looking at me. But I always urge people if you are updating a meeting or you're presenting something, I always stand up. And, I mean, I then turn my camera off and sit down again so they don't really realize. But if you're standing up, you just feel more confident.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:41:57]:
The diaphragm's expanded. And there's something about being upright than, you know, we're sitting down in our comfortable chairs, and some people's posture isn't very good. So that's 1 thing. And the other thing I think is try and use your body language. And, okay, we're stuck in these little boxes. And yours is big at the moment, and I'm sure mine is. But when there's 90 of us, we're stuck in them. And but to be as natural and as real as we are in real life because that will be conveyed.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:42:26]:
So not to think, oh, it's only online. I don't have to bother. I'll turn my camera off or I won't even look. But I'm I've had instances where people have actually I think, what are they doing? Are they reading something? Are they on their computer? And there's no sense of connection. And I'll call it out, especially if it's a small group, very politely, of course, because I think, you know, if I'm going to the trouble of being as informative as possible, you want to know that people are actually listening. I'm a bit of a tyrant, it sounds, doesn't it? I'm not really.

David Hall [00:42:57]:
Yeah. Definitely turn your camera on and be ready.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:43:02]:
Choose your arms and your I was gonna say arms and legs, but I meant Yeah.

David Hall [00:43:06]:
Arms arms is probably good. Yeah. And, I mean, I have never really thought about standing up online, but you just, you know, you you just make your setup so you could do that.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:43:18]:
Abs I mean, I have a grand piano. I create my own lectern, and I just feel so much more comfortable because I think I'm fairly as you can see, well, I try to keep as still as possible, but I feel more comfortable on my feet when I'm standing. Because when I'm sitting, I'm usually relaxing or reading a book. So it's anti it's it's counterintuitive for me.

David Hall [00:43:41]:
Yeah. So you're you're bringing that same energy to yourself that you would, you know, if you were speaking on a stage in front of, you know, others.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:43:49]:
Or in a meetings in face to in a in a group. Absolutely. And I think that's the problem that we tend to create 2 identities. Oh, it's only online. I don't have to bother. And yes. So as you said, bring that same energy, very good point, to the online as you would to face to face.

David Hall [00:44:08]:
And so sounds like you're saying treat it the same. And

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:44:11]:
Well, I mean, yes. It's not the same, but, yes, treat it the same.

David Hall [00:44:15]:
Yeah. Yeah. Okay. And it's amazing. You know, technology allows us to you know, we're 8 hours apart, allows us to have this great conversation and, you know, same. You know? Alright. Susan, we've covered so many great things today. There's so many good things that people will take away from this message.

David Hall [00:44:32]:
Is there anything else that you wanted to share?

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:44:34]:
Well, no. Other than it's been a great pleasure for me to share my thoughts and I'm always a great ambassador for speaking with Gravitas. And really 1 message to you, any highly sensitive people or introverts out there, please know you have the potential to be outstanding speakers. I know this because I teach. I have taught many introverts and it's just taking that first step. It's it is hard, but it's a lifelong skill. And, you really are the most gifted communicators.

David Hall [00:45:11]:
Well said. I think that's a great way to end. It's introverts, highly sensitive people, can be amazing speakers, but they just might have to do some things to learn how to do that. Alright. And, of course, where can people find out more about the work that you do?

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:45:26]:
Well, they thank you, David. They can connect with me on LinkedIn, doctor Susan Laverick, or they can look at my website, which is Laverick Consulting Geneva.

David Hall [00:45:36]:
Alright. And I will put that in the show notes. Thanks again, Susan. This has been a wonderful conversation.

Dr. Susan Laverick [00:45:41]:
Oh, I've loved it, David, and thank you for taking the time to talk to me.

David Hall [00:45:46]:
Thank you so much for joining me today. I look forward to further connecting with you. Reach out at david [at] quietandstrong.com or check out the quietandstrong.com website, which includes blog posts and links to social media channels. Send me topics or guests you would like to see on the show. If you're interested in getting to know yourself better, there's now a free type finder personality assessment on the Quiet and Strong website. This free assessment will give you a brief report, including the 4 letter Myers Briggs code, and you can also have the option of purchasing the full report if you'd like to learn more. I'll add a link to the show notes. So many great things about being an introvert, and we need those to be understood.

David Hall [00:46:26]:
Get to know your introverted strengths and needs, and be strong.